“You going to just stare at that coffee?” Lillian asked.
I smiled at being caught in an unguarded state of preoccupation with my dark thoughts. Then I took a sip of the decaf.
“It’s good. Tastes like the real thing,” I said, and this time I was telling the truth.
“Nothing hard about making a good cup of coffee,” Lillian said to this customer as she lit up another cigarette.
And that statement provided something of an answer to my questions about Lillian and her business. Because the coffee at the Metro Diner didn’t have to be as good as it was, nor did the excellent food served there have to be so carefully prepared or so reasonably priced. That was not how we did things where I happened to work. The company that employed me strived only to serve up the cheapest fare that its customers would tolerate, churn it out as fast as possible, and charge as much as they could get away with. If it were possible to do so, the company would sell what all businesses of its kind dream about selling, creating that which all our efforts were tacitly supposed to achieve: the ultimate product –– Nothing. And for this product they would command the ultimate price –– Everything.
It's strange to me to see Chipotle as the face of this. You can still get a chicken burrito which has 60g of protein and 1000 calories for just about $10. In my opinion, the only issue with their food is that the sodium is a bit high which is pretty unavoidable with fast food.
A similar burrito from any other local place near me is $15 or more. These might be a bit healthier but it's 50% more expensive.
You can definitely meal prep everything for a Chipotle burrito or bowl for about half the price meal but that doesn't factor in the time to grocery shop and cook (and also buy tortillas from Chipotle because for some reason you can't get them as a consumer from any wholesaler...). I opt for making burritos that can be frozen instead and it's nice having a freezer filled with 3-4 different options that take 5 minutes to defrost/reheat in the microwave. @stealth_health_life on instagram has a bunch of great recipes but it's also not really hard to just prep individual burrito fillings and make your own.
Chicken burrito costs $11.50 without any additions before taxes where I am. Closer to $12.85 with taxes.
Chipotle lists its portion size for protein to be 4oz which roughly translates to 27g of protein IF they don’t skimp on the portions (which they usually do. Unless the rest of the ingredients make up for 33g of protein, it’s very hard to get what you’re suggesting at Chipotle anymore.
On the other hand, the Mexican truck down the street sells $3 street tacos with way more meat.
I had to take a long distance road across the US for work in the spring. I planned my hotel for the night to be around a Chipotle along the way. It’s one of the few options that isn’t synthetic and doesn’t make me feel the awful “I’m traveling for work trash diet” feeling. Some actual vegetables and protein at least. Didn’t have time to seek out local places and delivery is hit or miss. Is it possible their prices are up because the cost of “actual food” has gone up? Beyond that you’re eating low quality borderline carnival food (sugar, cheese blob, deep fried) and mono sodium glutamate loaded Christian faith based chicken sandwich offerings.
The food seems to have become worse and worse too.
I’m pretty sure the last several times I’ve eaten chipotle, across several states, I’ve been given hard rice and cold meat. I don’t remember it being that common a decade ago.
Thank God taco trucks have become practically ubiquitous, even in small cities and suburbs. Not always cheaper than Chipotle, but definitely better quality (and usually cheaper..)
Make sure to eat at one with their food license displayed or readily visible. Botulism is not cool, and food trucks are already hard to regulate. I love food trucks though.
These were Brian Niccol decisions before he parachuted over to his ~$100M pay package at Starbucks as their CEO.
> In 2018, Niccol became the CEO of Chipotle Mexican Grill, replacing founder Steve Ells. Although Niccol had moved west to Newport Beach, California to join Taco Bell, he did not move back east to Denver when he joined Chipotle. Rather, under his leadership, Chipotle moved its headquarters from Denver to Newport Beach. During his tenure, he helped double Chipotle's revenue while its profits increased almost seven times. The stock price of Chipotle has increased by almost eight times under Niccol. Niccol also increased salaries for Chipotle's retail staff and expanded employee benefits. In 2023, Niccol's total compensation at Chipotle was $22.5 million, or 1,354 times the median employee pay at Chipotle for that year.
As govt inflation rates are often reported lower than actual, there's a good chance real inflation (or perhaps food inflation) was higher, and in spitting distance of 45%.
All takeout food did. I struggle to find why Chipotle would be considered expensive relative to other takeout options. You're getting chicken and 10 additional whole foods options for $10, when most other Mediterranean, Chinese, Japanese, taqueria, etc. options are at least a few $ more.
In the East Bay, I've noticed that the chain restaurants are consistently more expensive. Chipotle is more expensive than the taqueria down the street, not by a lot, but by a buck or two. And the bigger chains jacked up prices by more than the more regional ones: Subway costs the same as Togo's. McDonald's costs more than In n Out.
Businesses have found that people are willing to spend ~$20 on a fast/fast-casual lunch, and now most everybody charges that amount. But the national chains are also aiming for food consistency between locations, which means that my Chipotle and McDonald's meal is going to be only as good as they can economically make it in a blasted food desert like Indianapolis, whereas the local restaurants and regional chains can take advantage of me living less than 200 miles of 40% of the country's fresh produce production.
The fast food / fast-casual segments are losing price differentiation, and the fast food options are losing on quality.
Other fast food options have recently marketed and offered cheaper options. Chipotle doesn't have a very deep menu. I see they sell a single taco for around $4 but not many other "value" options.
That’s kind of why Chillis is doing pretty well. It costs almost the same as McDonalds and for a few bucks extra, you’d get a reasonable sit down experience.
They're also benefiting from being practically the last man standing in the family dining segment. They're not in a menu category that was going to butt up against nicer sit-down dining places (if Olive Garden, for example, raised their prices much they'd be running up against sit down Italian places, likewise for Red Lobster and nicer seafood). And they adapted well to the COVID-era takeout boom, which suggests that they were actually serving food people would choose to eat, not merely offering the sit down experience like say Applebees.
And, some may have the luck or guidance to know rice, beans, lentils, etc. can be bought in bulk quantities and stored long enough to be very cost-efficient.
And what food do we as a society think is appropriate for them to afford? That is, what structure (social services, etc) do we need to have in place to enable that should-statement
We probably shouldn’t have the government lobster truck that comes by and gives everybody a fresh lobster, but people’s nutritional needs should be met. In modern society with modern agriculture, we could afford to do that just fine. I think the thing that’s really broken right now is the food environment that people have to choose from. It makes a program like snap or EBT less cost-effective in terms of getting nutrition to people.
It's funny when people use lobster as an example because it used to be literal bottom tier food served to prisoners. So I hope we can do at least as good as the lobster truck.
Good tasting (for their culture), fresh, nutritious, and calorically dense food available from somewhere at least as convenient as a grocery store. As well as some extra money to afford a few prepared meals and a few 'luxury' food items. The first to encourage socialization (i.e. you can go out with your friends/family without shame) and because life without small joys isn't.
That's probably where I would put the floor in order to avoid a population that actively desires my head on a platter.
I’ve said this before on HN. Behind all the AI enthusiasm and evangelism on HN and tech industry in general, people forget: When most people are out of a job, AI won’t be Doordashing you $15 burrito from Chipotle that cost $30 to deliver. You need a backup plan for when things go South and so far, there doesn’t even seem to be a conversation going on about it.
That AI is not a bubble might be true, though that this mighty edifice glowing brightly in all freqencys of the spectrum is sitting on quick sand, is another truth.
“You going to just stare at that coffee?” Lillian asked.
I smiled at being caught in an unguarded state of preoccupation with my dark thoughts. Then I took a sip of the decaf.
“It’s good. Tastes like the real thing,” I said, and this time I was telling the truth.
“Nothing hard about making a good cup of coffee,” Lillian said to this customer as she lit up another cigarette.
And that statement provided something of an answer to my questions about Lillian and her business. Because the coffee at the Metro Diner didn’t have to be as good as it was, nor did the excellent food served there have to be so carefully prepared or so reasonably priced. That was not how we did things where I happened to work. The company that employed me strived only to serve up the cheapest fare that its customers would tolerate, churn it out as fast as possible, and charge as much as they could get away with. If it were possible to do so, the company would sell what all businesses of its kind dream about selling, creating that which all our efforts were tacitly supposed to achieve: the ultimate product –– Nothing. And for this product they would command the ultimate price –– Everything.
great writing style
I think from this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Work_Is_Not_Yet_Done
It's strange to me to see Chipotle as the face of this. You can still get a chicken burrito which has 60g of protein and 1000 calories for just about $10. In my opinion, the only issue with their food is that the sodium is a bit high which is pretty unavoidable with fast food.
A similar burrito from any other local place near me is $15 or more. These might be a bit healthier but it's 50% more expensive.
You can definitely meal prep everything for a Chipotle burrito or bowl for about half the price meal but that doesn't factor in the time to grocery shop and cook (and also buy tortillas from Chipotle because for some reason you can't get them as a consumer from any wholesaler...). I opt for making burritos that can be frozen instead and it's nice having a freezer filled with 3-4 different options that take 5 minutes to defrost/reheat in the microwave. @stealth_health_life on instagram has a bunch of great recipes but it's also not really hard to just prep individual burrito fillings and make your own.
Chicken burrito costs $11.50 without any additions before taxes where I am. Closer to $12.85 with taxes.
Chipotle lists its portion size for protein to be 4oz which roughly translates to 27g of protein IF they don’t skimp on the portions (which they usually do. Unless the rest of the ingredients make up for 33g of protein, it’s very hard to get what you’re suggesting at Chipotle anymore.
On the other hand, the Mexican truck down the street sells $3 street tacos with way more meat.
I had to take a long distance road across the US for work in the spring. I planned my hotel for the night to be around a Chipotle along the way. It’s one of the few options that isn’t synthetic and doesn’t make me feel the awful “I’m traveling for work trash diet” feeling. Some actual vegetables and protein at least. Didn’t have time to seek out local places and delivery is hit or miss. Is it possible their prices are up because the cost of “actual food” has gone up? Beyond that you’re eating low quality borderline carnival food (sugar, cheese blob, deep fried) and mono sodium glutamate loaded Christian faith based chicken sandwich offerings.
The food seems to have become worse and worse too.
I’m pretty sure the last several times I’ve eaten chipotle, across several states, I’ve been given hard rice and cold meat. I don’t remember it being that common a decade ago.
Blaming the economy or customers is not going to fix the real problem: decline in product value - quality, quantity and price.
Thank God taco trucks have become practically ubiquitous, even in small cities and suburbs. Not always cheaper than Chipotle, but definitely better quality (and usually cheaper..)
Make sure to eat at one with their food license displayed or readily visible. Botulism is not cool, and food trucks are already hard to regulate. I love food trucks though.
That sounds excellent but I tend to find stuff through the internet. How do you know where they’ll be?
Someone tweeted it somewhere, but Chipotle should make a burrito that is half the size and half the price.
Lol they used to be double or even triple the size and same/less price
They make them that big because they try to justify the price.
Chipotle raised their prices 45% in 5 years.
These were Brian Niccol decisions before he parachuted over to his ~$100M pay package at Starbucks as their CEO.
> In 2018, Niccol became the CEO of Chipotle Mexican Grill, replacing founder Steve Ells. Although Niccol had moved west to Newport Beach, California to join Taco Bell, he did not move back east to Denver when he joined Chipotle. Rather, under his leadership, Chipotle moved its headquarters from Denver to Newport Beach. During his tenure, he helped double Chipotle's revenue while its profits increased almost seven times. The stock price of Chipotle has increased by almost eight times under Niccol. Niccol also increased salaries for Chipotle's retail staff and expanded employee benefits. In 2023, Niccol's total compensation at Chipotle was $22.5 million, or 1,354 times the median employee pay at Chipotle for that year.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Niccol#Chipotle_Mexican_...
https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/CMG/chipotle-mexic...
https://sherwood.news/business/chipotle-sales-grown-since-20...
(he's also staunchly anti labor/anti union)
25% official inflation is reported here, for the last five years:
https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/2020?amount=1
As govt inflation rates are often reported lower than actual, there's a good chance real inflation (or perhaps food inflation) was higher, and in spitting distance of 45%.
All takeout food did. I struggle to find why Chipotle would be considered expensive relative to other takeout options. You're getting chicken and 10 additional whole foods options for $10, when most other Mediterranean, Chinese, Japanese, taqueria, etc. options are at least a few $ more.
In the East Bay, I've noticed that the chain restaurants are consistently more expensive. Chipotle is more expensive than the taqueria down the street, not by a lot, but by a buck or two. And the bigger chains jacked up prices by more than the more regional ones: Subway costs the same as Togo's. McDonald's costs more than In n Out.
Businesses have found that people are willing to spend ~$20 on a fast/fast-casual lunch, and now most everybody charges that amount. But the national chains are also aiming for food consistency between locations, which means that my Chipotle and McDonald's meal is going to be only as good as they can economically make it in a blasted food desert like Indianapolis, whereas the local restaurants and regional chains can take advantage of me living less than 200 miles of 40% of the country's fresh produce production.
The fast food / fast-casual segments are losing price differentiation, and the fast food options are losing on quality.
Other fast food options have recently marketed and offered cheaper options. Chipotle doesn't have a very deep menu. I see they sell a single taco for around $4 but not many other "value" options.
That’s kind of why Chillis is doing pretty well. It costs almost the same as McDonalds and for a few bucks extra, you’d get a reasonable sit down experience.
They're also benefiting from being practically the last man standing in the family dining segment. They're not in a menu category that was going to butt up against nicer sit-down dining places (if Olive Garden, for example, raised their prices much they'd be running up against sit down Italian places, likewise for Red Lobster and nicer seafood). And they adapted well to the COVID-era takeout boom, which suggests that they were actually serving food people would choose to eat, not merely offering the sit down experience like say Applebees.
The other places make your food fresh and isn’t cafeteria food.
Worth noting their prices vary heavily by location. In my area it's often the more expensive option.
What food can young people without jobs afford?
Plastic wrapped instant noodles packages.
And, some may have the luck or guidance to know rice, beans, lentils, etc. can be bought in bulk quantities and stored long enough to be very cost-efficient.
Such people are not jobless very long.
And what food do we as a society think is appropriate for them to afford? That is, what structure (social services, etc) do we need to have in place to enable that should-statement
We probably shouldn’t have the government lobster truck that comes by and gives everybody a fresh lobster, but people’s nutritional needs should be met. In modern society with modern agriculture, we could afford to do that just fine. I think the thing that’s really broken right now is the food environment that people have to choose from. It makes a program like snap or EBT less cost-effective in terms of getting nutrition to people.
It's funny when people use lobster as an example because it used to be literal bottom tier food served to prisoners. So I hope we can do at least as good as the lobster truck.
I guess I have weird cultural connotations then lol, but my point stands for whatever is expensive to produce.
Good tasting (for their culture), fresh, nutritious, and calorically dense food available from somewhere at least as convenient as a grocery store. As well as some extra money to afford a few prepared meals and a few 'luxury' food items. The first to encourage socialization (i.e. you can go out with your friends/family without shame) and because life without small joys isn't.
That's probably where I would put the floor in order to avoid a population that actively desires my head on a platter.
I’ve said this before on HN. Behind all the AI enthusiasm and evangelism on HN and tech industry in general, people forget: When most people are out of a job, AI won’t be Doordashing you $15 burrito from Chipotle that cost $30 to deliver. You need a backup plan for when things go South and so far, there doesn’t even seem to be a conversation going on about it.
That AI is not a bubble might be true, though that this mighty edifice glowing brightly in all freqencys of the spectrum is sitting on quick sand, is another truth.
I'm sure they can fix this buy giving the CEO another salary increase